THN Archive: Pens' Lemieux Led Charge Against Fighting In 1989 All-Star NHL Player Poll

For as long as hockey has existed, there's been a debate about the place of fighting in the sport. And at the NHL level, there’s been much discussion on how to deal with fighting. That much can be seen when combing through THN’s exclusive Archive.

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In the cover story from our Feb. 24, 1989 edition – Vol. 42, Issue 23 – writer Bob McKenzie polled 20 NHL all-stars and got intriguing reactions:

Seven of 20 weren’t satisfied with the NHL’s fighting rules. At the time of the story, the league allowed two major penalties without a game misconduct. Of the seven players not satisfied with those NHL rules, four wanted an automatic game misconduct penalty with the first fighting major. And five of the seven said they want automatic multiplying suspensions for repeat offenders.

The majority of players polled were content with the rules governing fighting, with the sentiments of then-22-year-old defenseman Dave Manson accurately representing them.

“They will never get fighting out of the game,” Manson said, “You have to have fighting. Guys have to let out their frustrations.”

“I’m not a fighter so I don’t even worry about it,” added winger Jimmy Carson. “(Fighting) has been there so long. I accept it as part of the game.”

That said, the players who did speak out in favor of harsher rules for fighting were about as big-name as it gets – including Wayne Gretzky and Mario Lemieux. Judge for yourself how you feel about fisticuffs in hockey, but you can’t deny the players who are at the top of the competitive mountain believe in the sport more than they believe in the sport’s fighting element.

“Our game is a speed-and-finesse game and we should not allow people to fight,” Lemieux said. “Look at the other sports (football, baseball and basketball). Any time there is a fight in those sports, there is a big suspension that goes with it. It should be the same in hockey.”

“We’re the only professional sport that allows (fighting),” added winger Paul Reinhart. “It’s time to try (banning fighting). The game is strong. We can be stronger. What do we have to lose? What are we afraid of?”

By Bob McKenzie

Vol. 42, Issue 23, Feb. 24, 1989

If there is a groundswell of anti-fighting sentiment in the National Hockey League, it has yet to touch Dave Manson.

Nor is it likely to.

“They will never get fighting out of the game,” said the defiant 22-year-old Chicago Blackhawk defenseman, every bit a traditionalist. “You have to have fighting. Guys have to let out their frustrations.”

You might expect that reasoning from this season’s penalty king — 273 minutes in 56 games. But what about avowed pacifists, such as Jimmy Carson of Edmonton and Pat LaFontaine of the New York Islanders?

Neither is as bullish on brawling as Manson, but when the battle lines are drawn, they all end up in the same comer.

Carson and LaFontaine are among those NHL players who believe existing rules on fighting are just fine.

Change? Who needs it?

Vancouver’s Paul Reinhart for one. Pittsburgh’s Mario Lemieux for another. Count them among those in an anti-fight lobby, which gained a considerable boost when Los Angeles superstar Wayne Gretzky spoke out early this year.

“We’re the only professional sport that allows it,” said Reinhart. “It’s time to try (banning fighting). The game is strong. We can be stronger. What do we have to lose? What are we afraid of?”

Twenty of 40 players at the NHL All-Star Game in Edmonton weren’t afraid of addressing the issue. Exactly half of the all-stars completed The Hockey News’ five-question survey on fighting in the NHL.

■ Thirteen of 20 said they are satisfied with current fight legislation. NHL rules call for a five-minute fighting major. Three majors in one game result in an automatic game misconduct.

■ Eleven of 20 said they believe in the “safety-valve” theory. That is, a crackdown on fighting would lead to an increase in stick fouls because hockey is an emotional game and players must have an outlet for their frustration.

■ Respondents ranked the media as the group most bothered by fighting. In a question meant to determine who the players believe is most offended by fighting, they were asked to rank five hockey groups. Players used a scale of one to five, with one representing the most offended. The results were: 1. Media; 2. Players; 3. Fans; 4. General managers; 5. Coaches.

■ Of the seven players not satisfied with current NHL rules, four said they want to see an automatic game misconduct with the first fighting major. That would bring fighting rules in line with those governing high-sticking infractions. Players assessed high-sticking majors are given automatic game misconducts.

■ Five of those seven said they want automatic multiplying suspensions for repeat offenders—the same as the anti-stick measures. In other words, two fighting game misconducts would call for an automatic one-game suspension, three game misconducts a two-game suspension and so on.

“Our game is a speed-and-finesse game and we should not allow people to fight,” said Lemieux, the NHL’s leading scorer.

“Look at the other sports (football, baseball and basketball). Any time there is a fight in those sports, there is a big suspension that goes with it. It should be the same in hockey.

“If the right people care enough about it, it will happen. But you need more than one or two or three people talking about it to change it.”

It’s not only the pure finesse players who would like to see action taken. Hartford’s Kevin Dineen, who combines brain and brawn and isn’t averse to dropping his gloves, is not satisfied with the status quo.

But he stopped short of recommending an all-out ban.

“If you don’t allow one fight (per player) per game,” he said, “you’ll have players being incited into a fight just to get them kicked out. But two fights for a game misconduct instead of (the current) three would be a step in the right direction.”

On the other hand…

“I’m not a fighter so I don’t even worry about it,” said Carson. “It (fighting) has been there so long. I accept it as part of the game.”

Detroit captain Steve Yzerman, who is satisfied with existing rules, suggested the impetus for change has to come from the NHL hierarchy.

“To this point,” he said, “the league hasn’t expressed that it wants to make changes in that area.”

It is clear many of the players believe the media is more concerned about fighting than any other segment of the hockey community.

“The U.S. media blows it out of proportion,” said Winnipeg’s Dave Ellett, an American.

When Gretzky spoke out against fighting — the first time he’s done so in his 10-year NHL career — it was because he believes potential hockey fans in the U.S. are being turned off. And that the growth of the game will be limited until the fighting issue is tackled.

“I’m not sure if banning fighting is the answer,” replied Edmonton’s Kevin Lowe. “But something has to be done in order to enhance the marketability and perception of hockey in the U.S.”

If there is a surprise in the survey results, it is the high number of players (nine of 20) who don’t believe in the safety-valve theory.

Washington’s Scott Stevens cannot fathom how a decrease in fighting would automatically lead to more high-sticking.

“Teams just can’t afford to be killing five-minute majors for high-sticking,” he said.

Ellett said the absence of fighting in U.S. college hockey has contributed to excessive stickwork, but Calgary’s Joe Nieuwendyk denied high-sticking and fighting have an inverse relationship in the college game.

Of course, fighting isn’t the problem it was in the mid-’70s. Montreal’s Mats Naslund, a Lady Byng Trophy winner who accepts the status quo, said he’s noticed a big change during his six-plus seasons in the league.

“There have been a lot of changes for the better,” he said. “The rule to stop defensemen from coming in from the blue line after the whistle really helped. So did the rules against brawling and extra penalties for instigators. Now, they’re going after high-sticking. It’s getting better all the time.”

NHL Players’ Association executive director Alan Eagleson remembered the last time the players took a stand on fighting.

“It was back in 1975 and we, as an association, voted in favor of recommending a ban on fighting,” he said. “It was categorically rejected by the rules committee.

“I suspect it might be a little different now. We send out a survey to our membership each March and ask a variety of questions on the game. This year, our survey will include a question on fighting. It’s become quite topical.

“It’s my opinion, after watching Canada Cup games and international hockey, that fighting isn’t necessary. But I’m sure there are some players, especially the guys who might lose their jobs if fighting was out, who might have something to say on that.”

The Hockey News Archive is a vault of 2,640 issues and more than 156,000 articles exclusively for subscribers, chronicling the complete history of The Hockey News from 1947 until today. Visit the archives at THN.com/archive and subscribe today at subscribe.thehockeynews.com